Columbia University has invited Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad to give a speech tomorrow at the Morningside campus, Columbia's president, Lee Bollinger, announced late last night. In a statement released just before midnight, Bollinger said he did not invite Ahmadinejad personally, but learned yesterday that Columbia had extended the invitation.
It's not certain, however, that Ahmadinejad will attend a world leaders academic summit that is taking place at the school. Because of the short notice, Bollinger said he couldn't be sure that high-level security arrangements would be put in place in time.
Columbia's last-minute offer to Ahmadinejad was evidently made under secrecy and confusion. Last night, Columbia's vice president for public affairs, Susan Brown, denied that the invitation had been extended, saying it was "rumors, rumors, rumors."
Although Bollinger said he strongly disagreed with Ahmadinejad's views, he would not stop him from speaking at the university's world leaders forum. "I happen to find many of President Ahmadinejad's stated beliefs to be repugnant, a view that I'm sure is widely shared within our university community," Bollinger said. "So whether or not all of the special arrangements needed for such a visit can be made in this unusually short period of time, I have no doubt that Columbia students and faculty would use an open exchange to challenge him sharply and are fully capable of reaching their own conclusions."
It would be the latest example of Ahmadinejad making the most of his visa to make limited travel on U.S. soil. Last evening he was interviewed by Brian Williams, in which he again denied the Holocaust and said Israel was "the root cause of many of our problems." The full text of the interview is below the fold.
The most interesting statement from Ahmadinejad was this, where he showed how fearful he is of international economic sanctions: "Iran has been under sanctions for 27 years. Even spare parts for aircraft are denied to us. Is this against the government, or an act against the people? Again, I'm saying in Iran the government and the nation are one. And I am the representative of the Iranian people, certainly not as a judge but as an elected official."
By making an effort to get the message out there that sanctions will not only hurt the regime but the Iranian people, Ahmadinejad seeks to further undermine the already weak international community and efforts to impose sanctions to dissuade the regime from uranium enrichment and reprocessing activities. Statements like the one above are very telling. The regime is working overtime to keep sanctions from being imposed because they are weak, and they know it. Instead of backing down, the international community must follow through with the disincentives presented this summer.
MSNBC INTERVIEW WITH IRANIAN PRESIDENT MAHMOUD AHMADINEJAD INTERVIEWER: BRIAN WILLIAMS
WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 20, 2006MR. WILLIAMS: Back to our exclusive interview with the president of Iran. He is the son of a blacksmith. He is the former mayor of Tehran. He won the presidency out of nowhere. He has made news often with his sometimes outrageous statements.
This married father of three speaks very little English, and so our conversation was through an interpreter, beginning with his message for the president.
(To President Ahmadinejad) If I was President Bush, sitting here across from you, what would you say to him, president to president, but more important, man to man?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: I think that the situation would have been better here if you were Mr. Bush. I sent him a letter.
MR. WILLIAMS: I'm aware of it.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: I raised some very serious issues. I really expressed my thoughts and beliefs. You know that I am teacher. I am interested in talks and in dialogue. I like to understand the truth, facts. And in that letter, I raised very important subject. I invited him to peace, brotherhood and friendship. But we did not receive an answer.
MR. WILLIAMS: And the American president says, "It's okay; keep your nuclear program to keep your homes warm. Stop enriching uranium toward weapons." How do you react?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: Who is the right judge for that? Any entity except for the IAEA? All IAEA reports indicate that Iran has had no deviation. We have said on numerous occasions that our activities are for peaceful purposes. The agency's cameras videotape all activities that we have.
Did Iran build the atomic bomb and use it? You must know that because of our beliefs and our religion, we are against such acts. We are against the atomic bomb. We believe bombs are used only to kill people.
MR. WILLIAMS: Why keep them in your arsenal if you don't someday hope to tip them with a nuclear weapon?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: So, are you thinking of the possibility of a danger? Is that what you're speaking of?
MR. WILLIAMS: I'm asking about your arsenal.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: Yes, we are powerful and strong in defending ourselves.
MR. WILLIAMS: Isn't the world a safer place without Saddam?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: It could have been. If you look at Iraq today, everybody was happy when Saddam was overthrown. People thought that the occupying forces would hand over the affairs of the country immediately to the people, at least as soon as possible.
Not only did they not leave, but they also said that they plan to stay. They are building huge military bases to stay. Since the overthrow of Saddam to this day, hundreds of thousands of civilians have been killed there. We think that this goes against the very rules of security.
You know we're very close with the people of Iraq. Many of our people are families and extended relatives. There have been a lot of intermarriages. There's the deep relationship on an emotional level between our people and theirs. Even Saddam's war against Iran did nothing to damage those old ties, because we've lived together for thousands of years.
The entire Iranian nation sympathizes with every Iraqi individual that suffers as a result of the occupation, whereas we know that according to international law, creating safety and security is the responsibility of the occupying force.
Iraqi authorities say that many of the tensions and the insecurity in the country is as a result of the occupation and occupying forces. Why should this be the case? It could have been much better. Saddam's removal could have been a very good beginning for the American government to strengthen its friendship ties with the nations of the region.
Everybody was happy in the beginning. But today the conditions in the region have changed. Anti-American sentiment, hatred towards the American government, has increased on a daily basis. Why is this the case? It could have been different. We are not happy with what we see there.
MR. WILLIAMS: Some of the fighters are trained and funded by your country shooting at the American soldiers.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: This is the claim the U.S. government makes. But there's no evidence. Insecurity in Iraq has the worst impact on Iran, because we're neighbors. We have very close ties with the Iraqi government and the Iraqi people.
We'd like to see a powerful Iraqi government. A powerful and secure government in Iraq will benefit Iran and benefit the entire region, because the government, the Parliament, the people of Iraq all have close relations with our neighbors. They're our friends.
MR. WILLIAMS: And yet I have stood on the helmets of Iranian soldiers which are now used as pavement on Saddam's old parade grounds. I think that also speaks to the bitterness on and off over the years between the two nations.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: Undoubtedly, Saddam hated us, but not the Iraqi people. Millions of people from Iran travel to Iraq on a yearly basis. Kurds, Sunni and Shi'as -- we're all friends. The Iraqi president is an old friend of mine. The head of state, the prime minister, is a very close friend of mine too. And the head of their Parliament, the Parliament speaker, is a good friend of mine. So we're friends.
MR. WILLIAMS: What was your reaction to the pope's speech? And do you accept his apology?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: I think that the people who give political advice to the pope were not well-informed.
MR. WILLIAMS: And do you accept his words of apology?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: I think that he actually takes back his statement, and there is no problem. He should be careful that those who want war do not take advantage of his statements and use it for their own causes. People in important positions should be careful about what they say. What he said may give an excuse to another group to start a war, where the religion should be used to support peace and brotherhood. Christ was a prophet for peace, as was Moses, and as was the Prophet Muhammad.
MR. WILLIAMS: There is something you said that upset and scared a lot of people. It upset a lot of Jews in the United States and around the world when you called the Holocaust a myth. There are people, some people I know, who escaped Hitler's reign. There is research, there are scholars, who can teach you about it, and yet you've expressed doubt about the Holocaust. Why?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: I've answered three of your questions on this. You know that I belong to the university. I'm an academician by nature. I'm interested in having a scientific approach to all events. But we've chosen three questions.
The first question was, in the Second World War, over 60 million people lost their lives. They were all human beings. Why is it that only a select group of those who were killed have become so prominent and important?
MR. WILLIAMS: Because of the difference humankind draws between warfare and genocide.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: Do you think that the 60 million who lost their lives were all the result of warfare alone? There were 2 million that were part of the military at the time. Perhaps altogether 58 million civilians with no roles in the war -- Christians, Muslims -- they were all killed.
The second and more important question that I raised was, if this event happened, and if it is an historical event, then we should allow everyone to research it and study it. The more research and studies are done, the more we can become aware of the realities that happened. We still leave open to further studies absolute knowledge of science or math. Historical events are always subject to revisions and reviews and studies. We're still revising our thoughts about what happened over thousands of years ago.
Why is it that those who ask such questions are persecuted? Why is every word such sensitivity or such prohibition on further studies on the subject, whereas we can openly question God, the prophets, concepts such as freedom and democracy?
And the third question that I raised in this regard: If this happened, where did it happen? Had the Palestinian people had anything to do with it? Why should the Palestinians pay for it now? Five million displaced Palestinian people is what I'm talking about; over 60 years of living under threat, losing the lives of thousands of dear ones and homes that are destroyed on a daily basis over people's heads.
You might argue that the Jews have the right to have a government. We're not against that. But where? At a place where their people will accept, where people will vote for them and where they can govern, not at the cost of displacing a whole nation and occupying a whole territory.
MR. WILLIAMS: Is that a change in your position that Israel should be wiped away? And second, would you ever be willing to sit down with Jews, with scholars, with survivors of Hitler's camps where 6 million died? Our American film director, Steven Spielberg, is one of many collecting the stories of those still alive who will tell you of the dead and the program to kill the Jews in Germany and elsewhere.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: I feel that there is a feeling of a need to escape the truth here among American politicians, as well as some media here. The main question is, if this happened in Europe, what is the fault of the Palestinian people? This is a problem we have today, the root cause of many of our problems, not what happened 60 years ago.
The Palestinian people, their lives are being destroyed today under the pretext of the Holocaust. Their lands have been occupied, usurped. What is their fault? What are they to be blamed for? Are they not human beings? Do they have no rights? What role did they play in the Holocaust?
Some attempt to sort of change the subject. From the first day I said, "Well, assuming that the Holocaust happened -- then again, what does it have to do with the Palestinian people? Not at all -- nothing."
Believe me, Palestinian people are human beings. They have feelings. They like to live in their own land, to have the right to self-determination, to feel secure in their homes, so that small kids are not killed, so that women are not taken from their homes, taken from their own homes.
MR. WILLIAMS: You say you have never repressed the rights of anyone, and you speak of the days when people were jailed for expressing opinions. Yet during your authority, 100 newspapers have been closed. Web bloggers have been shut down. Western culture and music have been stopped from entering Iran. Arguably that is not freedom of expression.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: You need to separate action that is taken legally and one that is taken illegally. You must also see that thousands of newspapers have been opened. Thousands of new opportunities are created. In our country, the law matters, a law approved by a representative of the people.
About three months ago, a newspaper associated with the government violated the law and was shut down, although it was really the only podium for our government, for the government's position. But it violated the law. So everybody is treated equally before the law.
Do you truly believe that using American music is a sign of freedom?
MR. WILLIAMS: I don't like all American music, but why not allow your people to -- (inaudible)? I have.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: But the problem of our people is not what you think it is, and this is the same mistake that the American government makes about Iran. Our people are really not going after the kinds of things that you think may matter. Our people are very free. They have a direct contact with the president. Regular people, everyone, they talk. They sometimes scream. And they debate. And the president is among them. Everybody is together, and they decide together.
Of course, there are, you know, differences of taste everywhere. We don't want people to be robots or to have a solid framework beyond which they can't move.
MR. WILLIAMS: But I think even our president expressed today America's quarrel is not with the Iranian people. It's with you.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: The war -- who is it against, the Iranian government or the Iranian people? It's against the Iranian nation. The bombardment of our cities by Saddam -- was that an act against the government or the people? Who supported Saddam? Were these truly acts against the Iranian government?
Iran has been under sanctions for 27 years. Even spare parts for aircraft are denied to us. Is this against the government, or an act against the people? Again, I'm saying in Iran the government and the nation are one. And I am the representative of the Iranian people, certainly not as a judge but as an elected official.
MR. WILLIAMS: I was interested; you wanted to be able to gesture with your hands while you spoke. What else should Americans know about you as a person, sir?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: About me? I'm an individual, one amongst the many of the Iranian people.
MR. WILLIAMS: You are traveling with your wife on this trip.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: Yes.
MR. WILLIAMS: May we know anything about her?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: She is an Iranian woman, and just as I am an Iranian too. And she is my friend and companion, and I am her companion.
MR. WILLIAMS: On that point, sir, you've expressed a desire to perhaps tour and see more of the United States. Do you think that day could ever come?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: It might.
MR. WILLIAMS: Where would you like to go?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: I don't really insist, but if I am here, it's possible to see different parts of America. Right now the time pressures are immense, and there's really no time.
MR. WILLIAMS: Is there any city or attraction you've --
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: No, it's the entire country. The American people are good people.
MR. WILLIAMS: Mr. President, this is not a matter of great concern, this next question, but we have gotten used to seeing you in the tan jacket with the zipper. Today you are dressed differently. Is that jacket a symbol of your standing or upbringing in Iran?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: No. It depends on which one I'm more comfortable wearing. And it, of course, depends too on my friends and colleagues. I knew that you were going to wear a suit, so I decided to wear this jacket.
MR. WILLIAMS: Excellent. You are on the cover of Time magazine here in the United States and around the world. Inside it says, "A date with a dangerous mind." Why do you think they think you have a dangerous mind? Do you?
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: You should hear what I have to say and then be the judge of that. I think that if people have a hard time accepting logic and facts, they should not actually accuse others. The picture is an attempt to darken my face a lot. I think it actually shows me much younger than I am.
MR. WILLIAMS: The president of the United States, speaking to the United Nations, today said, "To the people of Iran, the United States respects you." But he said, "Your government is using resources to fund terrorists and pursue nuclear weapons." He said he looks forward to the day when America and Iran can be good friends and close partners in the cause of -- (audio break) -- of the American president today.
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: We have the same desire -- to be together for the cause of world peace. But we have to see what the impediments are. Is it Iranian forces that have occupied countries neighboring the United States, or is it American forces that are occupying countries neighboring Iran?
If Mr. Bush thinks that he can place a distance between the Iranian nation and the Iranian government, he is wrong. I am a normal person, a very average, regular person in Iran. The nation decided that I become the head of state. The nation and the government are one and single, and together we share everything. But we too like to rise at a point where we can pursue the cause of world peace. But we have to remove the barrier. That's where the question lies.
MR. WILLIAMS: And that is where the United States president would say, "Halt this uranium enrichment."
PRESIDENT AHMADINEJAD: I question the -- world peace, is it being threatened by those who produce a third generation of nuclear bombs or those who seek peaceful nuclear technology for their power plants? We think that people who produce bombs cannot -- the atomic bomb -- cannot, in fact, speak of supporting world peace.
We all know that Iran's nuclear issue is an excuse. It's been 27 years now that we've faced the hostility of the U.S. administration in various forms. Let me tell you something. Before the revolution, the government in Iran was dependent on the United States; the U.S. administration, so to say.
The individual was a dictator in the complete sense of the word. He suppressed people. He used guns to put down people's demonstrations. I was a student at the time. Many of my friends were in prison because of reading books, because of expressing their opinions about social affairs. We produced 6 million barrels of oil then, only 600,000 of which was used domestically. The rest was exported. But our country was poor. The urban areas, as well as the villages, were in ruin. There was really no help. The cities were in poor condition, but the prisons were growing.
And that's when our nation rose to speak freedom, to seek free elections, and to have the right over its own fate. It expected that the U.S. administration, who claims to support freedom and democracy, to support it, to support it, or at least to remain silent. But from day one, the U.S. government has been against our nation.
Only one case, if I were to decide, was the support it gave to Saddam Hussein during the eight-year war against Iran. Do you know what happened during that war? Over 200,000 Iranian people, young men, died. Hundreds of thousands more were injured. At the same time, we were able to protect our country. But the U.S. government supported Saddam.
Nonetheless, our nation was interested in having friendly relations with everyone. There was a terrorist group inside Iran that, in fact, assassinated many of our authorities and officials -- the president, the prime minister, the ministers, the head of the supreme court, and many members of Parliament, regular people.
And America supported this group. The question is, why? We thought we might be able to have friendly relations with the United States, but the American government chose the wrong path, a path which is still continuing.
END.
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